Meditation group in Bayside teaches to subtract distractions

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When visitors walk through the front door and into the foyer of the unassuming, beige house on the residential 38th Avenue block of 216th Street in Bayside, they are asked politely, if they have not already done so, to remove their shoes.

Trepidations may also be left by the door, for slippers will be provided.

For about three years now, the house, numbered 38-15, has been the neighborhood’s center to experience Maum Meditation — a seven-step, guided method that encourages disciples to free themselves of the limitations their past experiences impose on their minds and bodies.

“The main thing here is not learning another thing, but subtracting,” said Amy Kim, an instructor who said she discovered the method for herself about 10 years ago. “At the time I was just going through a lot of stress. I just had a lot of questions about life in general. Everybody has that.”

According to the group’s literature, Maum was discovered in 1996, when Woo Myung became enlightened while meditating in the mountains of South Korea.

Kim said Maum rests on the principle that there are two worlds: the true world (great freedom, joy and eternal life) overlapped by the false world (lack of wisdom, endless hopelessness and despair).

In order to divest oneself of this false world, Kim said, Maum Meditation teaches adherents to subtract first their thoughts, then images of themselves and relationships and ultimately their bodies and the universe.

Once this is done, the self disappears and becomes the universe, the method teaches, and one can become the true world.

C.J. Le, an instructor in training at the center, was on Bell Boulevard earlier this month handing out pamphlets informing passersby of the free introductory lectures held every Tuesday and Thursday night at 7 p.m.

Kim said a monthly $150 fee allows members to visit the center for any length of time while it is open, seven days a week from 9 a.m. to 10 p.m.

Michael Clarke said he has been attending an intensive meditation course for a few months now. The Rosedale resident visits the center four or five times a week for 12 hours at a time.

He said it was the concept of “getting to know your mind” that attracted him to the method.

Maum also has centers in Flushing and Plainview, L.I. The Bayside center’s phone number is 718-225-3472.

Reach reporter Rich Bockmann by e-mail at or by phone at 718-260-4574.

Posted 4:46 pm, November 22, 2011
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Reader feedback

Clara Jacobson from Bayside says:
Maum Meditation = Subtraction

I Google'd 'maum meditation' to see what people are saying about it and found a conversation that had been going on for a couple years now. Reading through the comments, I felt compelled to write my own. I tried leaving a comment, but I don't know if it takes some time for it to be published, but I felt it's worth writing about in my blog as well.

Maum Meditation is a method of subtraction. Imagine a whiteboard completely filled with all the thoughts, emotions, feelings, and everything else preoccupying our minds. What Maum Meditation does is erase all of that so that we can return to the original, clean, clear state of mind, un-dirtied by all the things in our mind created by our life experiences.

There are no gurus, no rules, no regulations, no coercion. The only thing that Maum Meditation does is subtract. Subtract everything in my mind, subtract the rules and regulations. Subtract any doctrines, beliefs, prejudgments, preconceptions, notions. Subtract everything. The helpers are not instructors; they just guide you through the subtraction method. You're the one who subtracts the junk from your mind because only you know what's in your mind. And when that junk is thrown out, you'll be the one to know that junk is gone. Thinking about it mathematically, there is no end to addition, but there is an end to subtraction. Instead of continuing to draw more and more and more on the whiteboard, why not subtract and erase all the junk and return the whiteboard to the clean, original state? Only you know the state of your own whiteboard. Every human being does have his or her own concept of the truth, but after throwing all of that out as well, only what's real should remain, right?

If Maum Meditation were a cultish organization that only brainwashes people with no positive results, I seriously doubt that this organization would be growing at the rate it currently is. In July 2007, there were about 140 centers worldwide, in October 2010 about 290 centers. As of June 2011, there are more than 300 centers world-wide, with about 4-5 more centers scheduled to open all over the world at the moment. There also should have been some kind of media coverage already on how Maum Meditation is a scam and fraud if it really were. There is some coverage about knock-off organizations in Korea but not of Maum Meditation. To-date, there are only negative personal experiences on forums such as this one and no negative media coverage about Maum Meditation. (If you find any official negative reviews or media coverage, though, please provide the link so everyone can see. People have a right to know the truth, right? Check here for various media coverage about Maum Meditation.)

Yes, I do practice Maum Meditation, but I tried to give as objective an opinion as possible. I probably would have quit myself if I had noticed any cultish intentions. But there was something sincere and true behind the helpers' earnest requests and persuasions for me to complete all the levels. They really seemed to want to help me find truth in my life and wish for me to live well. That's what kept me there and helped me continue to subtract to find the truth.

Once I started subtracting, the changes that came along with getting rid of the junk in my mind made the helpers' persuasion unnecessary. I knew that I was at a place where the method actually works. No more dirtying the whiteboard. Anytime there's something to deal with, I can approach it with a clean slate, instead of an incredibly muddled one with no more space to use.

I encourage anyone and everyone to give this method of subtraction a sincere chance, and approach it with some patience and an open mind.
Aug. 11, 2012, 8:05 pm
Katrina from Everett says:
I liked the idea of the "false mind" can be thrown away through the method of Subtraction in Maum Meditation. Since I am living in the world where my illusions are attached, life was so much in stress and agonies.
And I usually don't buy others' own point of view on anything for that can be very subjective and limited only based on the extent of the experiences on their own.
Anyways, whatever it is said underneath my comments, regardless of that, Maum Meditation sounds very interesting place to meditate and explore my inner peace.
Dec. 18, 2012, 2:50 am
Jim from Long Beach says:
When I saw the pamphlet of this meditation in one restaurant, the word “Subtraction” hit my head. At that time, I was going through difficult time relationship-wise, and felt suffocated by the pressure and anxiety from the daily life. Even if I couldn’t understand what “Subtraction” meant, it came to me as a fresh air. I thought it could be the way out of my situation.
So I attended one of their free intro lectures to find out what exactly “Subtraction” means. According to the instructor, I have been accumulating pictures taken by 5 senses into my mind throughout my entire life. The accumulations of pictures have formed the false mind world, and I’ve been living in that world instead of living in the true world just as it is. Then he said, “In Maum Meditation, you are going to subtract those pictures in your mind that are false”, and added, “You are so much attached to those pictures which are the source of stress and burden.”
After the lecture, I decided to do this meditation right away. Since then, the pressure on my shoulder from my life has lifted and the relationship with people has improved much. Most of all, I can breathe truly now.
I’m so thankful to this meditation to help me overcoming the difficult situation. I’ve never thought about that it was possible to throw away the stress and burden I’ve been carrying around. Furthermore, by subtracting them I can find my true self IN MY LIFE. Thanks!
Dec. 18, 2012, 3:30 am
Mary from Bogota says:
Im starting my first meditation tmrw, so i can really say much yet. But i think u can find the word cult or fraud or scam if u use those words with anything. Everyones perception is different. To the kid up top that lost his dad to maum, thats just weird, but could happen to anything. Work, lovers, religion, drinking, drugs, etc. Seems like ur dad has an addicitve personality n i do believe maum would love to have u completely commited to them, what organization wouldnt?
Im not sure what to expect, but i hope i dont whind up losing my family n moving to korea for any reason. I am seeking truth, do i k ow this is the answer? No but i really am on a mission to meditate really well. I cant pratice at home and for $100 a month its a hell of a lot cheaper then theraphy. Fings crossed they dont eat my brain lol
Jan. 11, 2013, 8:05 pm
jack from offenhand says:
keeram shag shodeh
Sept. 6, 2013, 5:08 pm
Tom from Mandurah says:
My wife joined Maum Meditation in Western Australia 2 years ago. It become more and more important for here. The last 2 months she is there from 6 AM in the morning to 10 PM nighttime. You can imagine i am not very happy with the situation because i don`t see her anymore and life together gets more and more difficult . Also our kids are there some time during the week and on weekends. She was now asked to spend half of our savings for a 2 week stay at some center in Argentina to find the final enlightenment. For me it looks those people are more interested in finally getting your money even if they have to destroy a family. There is no guidance of what is considered a healthy amount of weekly participating hours. Helpers in the centers should be aware that problems in family's occur if the allow a married woman the be there 16 hrs a day 7 days a week if it is managed properly. I am looking forward to get some replays to this post from couples where only on of them joined Maum Meditation and / or if they have the same issues or not. English is not my language so there could be some funny mistakes in the text above but i think you know what my concern is. Thanks anyone who takes the time to answer with a few words.
June 11, 2014, 5:44 pm
gabriel from az says:
July 3, 2014, 3:51 am
Joahnna from New York says:
In a few words I want to tell you; If you want to lose the true help of heaven, keep going to maum meditation, and give to them everything you have, which one it is the purpose they have, even your soul.
Oct. 11, 2014, 2:16 pm
JJP from Singapore says:
My girlfriend and I had an identical experience to Unnon. Went to a seminar. Lots of testimonials about what an amazing experience maum meditation was and how it can change your life. Then a lecture from Woo Myung himself, lots of general stuff about 'subtraction' and throwing away your false self but no actually tangible information about the process. Lots about how he's won prizes and best selling books and then BAM just like that he is TELLING you to take out a form and fill it in with the pen provided, the form is a subscription to Meditation classes costing over a $100 a month. This did not feel like a suggestion or a choice, it was almost an order, we were then hounded by smiley and polite but very pushy 'helpers' urging us lots to fill in the forms to the point as if they thought we didn't know how to use a pen and paper. We felt cheated and a little bit embarrassed that we had even attended the lecture, it felt very much like a scam.
Oct. 21, 2014, 10:59 am
Rick from Rouen says:
Tom from Mandurah. Are you still reading this conversation? I would like to know how it is going. I will write my experience.
Oct. 29, 2014, 8:26 pm
Rick from Rouen says:
Probably everybody of us who got involved in to the maum meditation, one or another way are looking for spirituality and answers. The maum meditation helps to relieve stress to some people be more calm, because during it you are imagining throwing away all your past pictures in your mind. I really like Eckhart Tolle teaching, and maum meditation goes very good along with his teaching, but only about until level 4 or 5 in to the maum meditation. Thats where maum meditation takes completely different turn, destructive turn. What happens at that time , the person involved in this meditation start seeking the goal to finish this process, the maum leaders will tell that everyday you have to think and seek with all your power and strength how to achieve this goal. Thats where families and loved gets separated. Maum leaders don't tell you about “culmination process” at their camp when you sign up, it has hidden fee (its around 4000 euros or more), they will tell this later to you around level 4-5. Christ warned us about false prophets in the Bible, Matthew 7:15-17
Oct. 29, 2014, 9:02 pm
woo moung from Chicago says:
Please do not fall for this cult! They hide behind kindness, and claim to guide you with the truth. This is a new and upcoming cult. they have many centers all around the world. they claim to be a non profit organization but that is not true. They also sale a food supplement that is not FDA approved. This is a mind brain wash. Many people have left there personal, and professional life's so that they can join this cult. The founder who goes by name grand master, he has been exciled from korea. due to taking people away from their family. the helpers at all centers are very sketch, they refuse to talk about anything other than the meditation. they contradict them selfs often! please keep an eye for that. the main goal they have is to get u to sign up to their main center in korea. they want u to complete the meditation for 6 months in korea. once u complete they want u to leave your job, or career to become a meditation helper at a other center. they want u to do this at all cost even if it means leaving your family behind. They want u to donate your house as well. the one thing that is more dangerous than a physicall abuse is ... mental abuse. If u are in need of truth seek god! Do not let the helpers kindness fool u! $150 a month is what they charge and they sit u in a room and want to kill u in a dream so u can relive your whole life over. They want u to forget about your life even the good. they want u to walk away from it all.
Nov. 4, 2014, 1:14 am
Kim from Bristol says:
If happened that you end up at maum meditation center ask about a fee (they don't tell you about this, its around $6000 or more) they have at the last of their level, they will send to to some camp to meet their leader. Also here is some testimonial from previous member:
"Hello, throwaway here because I don't want to get killed lol (seriously though)
I joined this meditation thing called Maum Meditation. I still don't know much about cult-ism to correctly call what I'm thinking of, but it's basically a brainwashing group.
Kind of like a rotten onion, the outside seems perfectly normal but layer after layer as you get in deeper into its roots its rotten, basically. After some time they ask for "Sky Funds" to allow your ancestors to go to heaven from purgatory, about 1K USD.
But I think I should start with how the system works. There's 8 "levels" of meditation that gets progessively into the foundation of the cult, but there are three "extra special" levels "becoming born", "being your born entity" and a third one they just came up with. They come up with a new level every once in a while and the special levels after the 8 levels cost about 4K USD per person to attend to.
It's popping up in cities all over the world, but is having a hard time getting started. Please let your friends and lovers know about this cult and to stay away from it at all costs. They say that they are "science-based" with questionable UN and Ghandi awards but it's all just an illusion on the outside.
They routinely put spies to track their members (scary ——), check incoming members for electronic devices using the metal detectors, and is pretty much paranoid about getting caught with the media.
They also ask for you to give up all your life savings, quit your job, and give your life and body to the cause. Look up maum meditation cult on google, and you will see that any negative posts made, they have made sure to comment positively on it."
Nov. 4, 2014, 2:12 pm
Kim from Bristol says:
Here is another testimonial from someone who finished all their levels: " About maum meditation. Hi everyone, I finished all the levels plus three weeks full time in special house. Even I did three week for the culmination of the program, I didn't be completed,so business are business. At the beginning when I started the first level, the instructor told me about finishing all levels, all students must to do one week for the culmination . So , the main problem they never told us the truth. My question, how can they help to my find the truth, if they don't have truth? For all the people wants start this maum meditation, be careful! they never say to the students how much you must pay for the culmination of this meditation ( three weeks ...4.500 Dlls) plus all the levels you must to pay,150 Dlls each month , for a long time of two or three years. The main purpose of life is live healthy in boty and soul, but unfortunately there are doctrines and people who pose as teachers of life through lies make us lost faith in our true religion. The real danger without considering our consequences of the facts, is when we walk without seeing where we step, once we do this, maybe we can not solve our serious lack. Urgently people who has this mistake on brainwashing by beeing uninformed how is the process,need to be awakened but, mostly of them has not choice to recongnize this kind of situation.
as a result they could serve them for the rest of their live, so as required starting in the fourth leve without any paiment .The excuse has maum, is serving meditation centers is the way to find the heaven ,regardless in your home there aren't order in the economic and attention to your family."
Nov. 4, 2014, 2:29 pm
jaky from brea says:
I am a ex-member of Maum meditation and want to share some things with you!
How Maum mediation works :
It uses subtraction meditation technique. If you spend an hour to an hour and a half a day in meditation, after a few weeks, there is a great probability that you will not return to full beta consciousness. You will remain in a fixed state of alpha for as long as you continue to meditate I'm not saying this is bad--if you do it yourself. It may be very beneficial. But it is a fact that you are causing your mind to go flat. Maum meditation tells you it is human completion--which is simply a predictable physiological result! The more you meditate, the flatter your mind becomes and that’s were the danger comes when you allow someone else who you don’t fully know the motives of to take you through these steps and slowly alter deep beliefs about yourself and the world! And if heaven on earth is non-thinking and non-involvement, I really question why we are here. A schedule is maintained that causes physical and mental fatigue (That’s why you need to came meditate every day for at least 2 hours). The aim is to create a mechanism in flesh and blood with new beliefs and new thought processes. So you can be a drone and recruit more people who will bring more money to keep up wish lavish life style woo muyang lives! Heavy participation in meditation is a formula for psychological destruction.

Alright. Now, second tip-off that indicates conversion tactics are being used in maum meditation: Its important to cause your nervous system to malfunction, making it difficult to distinguish between fantasy and reality. This can be accomplished in several ways. Poor diet is one; sugar throws the nervous system off. More subtle is the " Self balancing food" used by maum meditation the one they want you to purchase! Do you know what in it?! It makes you to reduce alertness, especially when combined with long hours of meditation and sensory overload. You feel happy because your body produces serotonin and adrenalin, this hype is temporary and goes away in so you assessed with completing another level and chasing the rush. Those experiences will stop after some time, so you may find yourself in a dark spiritual pause.

These are altered-state-of-consciousness techniques that initially induce calmness by giving the mind something simple to deal with and focusing awareness. The continued use brings on a feeling of elation. And once some people are in a deep meditation state they become so "suggestible" that in addition to acting out the suggestion that they should relax deeply, they will swallow doctrinal indoctrination whole without rationally analyzing it. The result is the reduction of thought and eventually, if used long enough, the cessation of all thought and withdrawal from everyone and everything except that which the group direct. The takeover is then complete. It is important to be know that when members are instructed to use these techniques, they are told that they will benefit by so doing: they will find enlightenment and human completion. Crusading agenda to save the world or convert all souls to “universe mind.”
We are all conditioned that if someone gives us something, we have to give them something in return--in this case, it is your money.
The maum helpers have not told you this yet, they don't tell the truth until they get your mind controlled. After level 4 it will ask for "Sky Funds" to allow your ancestors to go to heaven from purgatory, about 1K USD. Really money will take then to heaven?
After level 7 is another level, or "culmination" process with the leader Woo Myung, it last about three weeks or so, and its usually held somewhere in Argentina, Korea, or some another place, they will ask you to pay large amount of money, around $6000, or more depends on your financial status. Without this culmination you wont be "complete!

NO ONE HAS EVER BEEN BRAINWASHED AND REALIZED, OR BELIEVED, THAT HE HADBEEN BRAINWASHED. Those who have been brainwashed will usually passionately defend their manipulators, claiming they have simply been "shown the light" . . . or have been transformed in miraculous ways.

Educate your self! Ask questions and check the answers.
How much money does founder Woo Myung make a year as head of Maum Meditation? Is he open about his salary, or is this information hidden? I would like to know the Truth. It would clarify his true self for us.

Look for these sings:
Nov. 17, 2014, 2:25 am
Jose from Barcelona says:
Maum Meditation comes from Korea, (same place where Moonies came from). They are experts in brainwashing techniques.

Little bit history. Dur­ing the Korean War, Korean captors reportedly brainwashed American POWs held in prison camps. Several prisoners ultimately confessed to waging germ warfare -- which they hadn't -- and pledged allegiance to communism by th­e end of their captivity. At least 21 soldiers refused to come back to the United States when they were set free.
In the late 1950s, psychologist Robert Jay Lifton studied former prisoners of Korean War and Chinese war camps. He determined that they'd undergone a multistep process that began with attacks on the prisoner's sense of self and ended with what appeared to be a change in beliefs. Lifton ultimately defined a set of steps involved in the brainwashing cases he studied:
Assault on identity
Breaking point
Compulsion to confess
Channeling of guilt
Releasing of guilt
Progress and harmony
Final confession and rebirth
Does Maum Meditation uses similar techniques ?
Nov. 18, 2014, 2:46 am
neklodon from Uganda says:
I have underwent through the meditation till level 4, i quit because i felt like i was being co-arsed to acknowledge that Woo Myung and his Wife are the "Owners of the Universe" The universe referes to the world, everyone and everything around it. This implies that Woo Myung who smokes by the way and his Wife are gods. The first doubt i had of the method was in level 1, they use bible scriptures to create the feeling that they have been in other religions too but they contradict themselves. They use words like God is Omipotent,Omnipresent and Omniperfect. Then they claim that it is until now that there is a method to save mankind while he is alive and enable him start living in heaven while in this world. This to me who is a christian implies that my God forgot that the man he put in this world needed salvation eventually from sin and his habits in that Woo Myung solved it on his behalf. This is an insult to God as they say aknowledge themselves that he is Omniperfect but then,how could he miss this? The helpers also get annoyed, frustrated, childish and lying is also common to cover up for their loose words. If you are thinking of joining or have already started Maum meditation, my advise to you is QUIT now if you have a religion. But if you are looking for a new religion then join it as it is not meditation but rather a religion. Meditation ends in level 3 mid-way,from there it gets religious with the theme being to move faster and get to "heaven" if you read books by Woo Myung, Sing and dance songs written by Woo Myung, recite poems written by Woo Myung what gets left is BOWING DOWN to Woo Myung.
Jan. 18, 2015, 5:54 pm
kevin from S.A. says:
Maum meditation is all a lie,to pass some stages like level 3 and 4, meditators are asked to acknowledge that Woo Myung and his Wife will live forever and that they are also the “owners” of the “universe.”
To pass through level 4,there is also a skyfund donation that is made based on the meditators ability, by the time the meditator gets to this level,they have already have a background idea of the job he/she does, his financial ability and willingness to do as they ask without questioning.
In between level 3 and 4, the meditators are also provided with a sheet of paper to write down how the meditation has aided them and what they have also learned so far which are edited and placed over the internet with their photos in facebook pages of the meditation centers, in their websited, bronchures and short video clips that are produced to entice others to join.There are statements that are also made across all the levels that the meditator has to agree with even if they do not seem realistic or rational. Statements like:
I. All religions are same as they worship one god.
II. Everyone is same.
III. Woo Myung and his wife are the “truth,owners of the universe and they will live forever.”
IV. Maum meditation changes people and is the only way for one to go to “heaven.”
V. People who did not go through the meditation are “crazy” and they will simply die and dissapper like a mayfly.
VI. Religions believe that there is a heaven after death but it is all false because according to Maum meditation, heaven starts once one achieves human completion while living and never dies.You dont get complete till you meet Woo Myung in the last level in what is called conference for "human completion"which is held in specific countries so you have to have cash to travel.
Jan. 18, 2015, 6:01 pm
Sandra from US says:
Noticed that maum meditation centers and websites start changing their name, they are dropping word MAUM, so now they just go by the location name like "San Francisco Meditation" or similar. Is this is some kind cover up by this cult ? Do they changing their name that it would be harder for people to find the truth about them ?
Feb. 24, 2015, 8:23 pm
confused says:
Can somebody please help me? This cult took away my husband from me and I cant find him. He left to Korea to the main center and has never been heard from again. His cell phone has been off for 3 weeks and when I call the main center phone number they hang up on me when I ask if he is at the center. What do i do???
March 3, 2015, 5:40 pm
xmaummember from US says:
To: confused
Not much you can do, your husband got his brain washed by this maum meditation cult, they reprogrammed his mind to serve the group. My advice- educate your self about mind control, about cults, also if got in contact with your husband by now, be loving and supportive.
April 16, 2015, 1:13 am
Rod Lasvegas from Bayside says:
Whether or not you believe Maum Meditation is a brainwashing cult, you should know that its credibility is built on a ridiculous lie. Its founder, Woo Myung DID NOT win a fictitious "Mahatma Gandhi Peace Prize" as its literature advertises. It's amazing and disturbing that such a —— claim could slip under the radar and never reach the globally expanding cult's followers.
This is directly quoted from Woo Myung's website ( : "In September 2002, Woo Myung visited UN headquarters in New York, where he met the then President of UN General Assembly, Han Seung-soo and discussed the way to realize the world peace. After that, he visited the headquarters of the UN-NGO, International Association of Educators for World Peace (IAEWP) in Huntsville, Alabama. There, the IAEWP awarded Woo Myung the Mahatma Gandhi Peace Prize for his contributions to human introspection and recovery of original nature, as well as reconciliation and peace, and appointed him as a World Peace Ambassador.
“Maum Meditation transcends the boundaries of all religions and cultures. And it is practiced truthfully without any falsehood and deception. While most diseases we have come from unnecessary desire, anxiety, and stress, Maum Meditation eliminates such minds and makes body and mind healthy. In addition, it enables us to solve wisely many problems we meet in our lives.” - Charles Mercieca, Ph.D., President of IAEWP, UN-NGO "
So what is IAEWP? "The International Association of Educators for World Peace (IAEWP) is a nongovernmental organization and engaged in the promotion of peace education. The International Association of Educators for World Peace was founded in 1969[1][2] under the leadership of Charles Mercieca, a native of Malta who was on the faculty of Alabama A&M University.[2] On its website, it claims to be affiliated to the United Nations. The IAEWP has its headquarters in Huntsville, Alabama."
There are actually FOUR awards that have anything to do with Gandhis and Peace:
We have the "International Gandhi Peace Prize": awarded annually by the Government of India. Recipients: NOT Woo Myung/Maum
Next we have the "Gandhi International Peace Award"" founded by the the "Gandhi Foundation": "a United Kingdom-based voluntary organisation which seeks to further the work of Mahatma Gandhi through a variety of educational events and activities." Guess who didn't get one!
And then the "Gandhi Peace Award": presented annually since 1960 by the US NGO Promoting Enduring Peace: "a pacifist organization and United Nations non-governmental organization (NGO) based in Connecticut USA." ( (THIS seems to be the award Maum are trying to get away with claiming to have won….but they didn't. Awk..)
If we really really want to give them the benefit of the doubt, there's the "Indira Gandhi Prize" which they still DID NOT WIN.
Aug. 1, 2015, 10:41 am
X.member of Maum from Canada says:
I was a very good member in Maum Mediation for two years. I had to quite with confusion and depression at the end of the level 4, when I was asked to confirm the founders (Woo Myung and his wife) are the owners of the universe-original foundation. It was when I was so disappointed that the purpose of all their subtraction method was to brainwash me. I remember that I explained to the helper (instructor) that it is not true, we had discussion and he was somehow agree with me in his heart that after this subtraction meditation we can not make such a statement that founders are the owners; but next day he said you are not enlightened and you can’t go for cultivation camp this year. I was so sad that time that I couldn’t pass level 4, but now I’m so happy that I still had some insight left in myself to distinguish this cult eventually. Rational mind is a good gift if we use it properly, to get free of so many layers of illusions, and not to give up to those truth-prostitutes in this crazy world.
At last, I forgive the founders and helpers, and I hope one day they realize what they’re doing is not good. I wish them the best, and I hope they change.
Dec. 3, 2015, 4:46 pm
Xmember from western state usa from Berkeley says:
I'm so glad you have this forum to warn people. I started the meditation looking to reduce stress and found the meditation center to be a very "supportive" place when at the time I was very vulnerable emotionally. I was the perfect candidate desperate for mental peace. I found that (peace)there for a few months however I stayed for a few years. I saw the "red flags" I chose ignore them. I got so deep into a cult and finally when I woke to the lies and coverup, I realized I was lucky to get out with my sanity. I was angry at first because I was not looking for a religion and they denied that it was. But it definitely is based on worship of the founders and they want you time and money. You will have no life if they get their way ..... I feel sorry for the helpers as they mean well-they are just sheep following their " father and mother". And they have been striped of their identity and money. And mostly their family! Look within to find the truth not MAum meditation... I realized it was always there and there was no need to go get indoctrinated into a "subtraction" method only to add garage when you become vulnerable. Run!!!!!!!!!!!
Jan. 2, 2016, 11:34 am
mary from canada says:
hi i was also involved in maum meditation for 2 and a half years. the weird thing is that for the only two levels i was in it actually benefited me. i mean i know there is a lot of controversy and especially when joining a group that you know the claims that are given are a little too good to be true, but still, i benefited while i was there. i became more confident, i felt better, in a way i became nicer. i was even more relaxed. one day i decided i would pray seeing as it had brought some positive effects on my mum and i had the oddest feeling, i don't know quite why that i had to leave. i mean i knew from the start everything that was going on in the organisation, but me being me i decided to see if the method would benefit me. i don't know if leaving was the best thing to do, but the feeling just got stronger as i was at the end of level two. so now i have left for a month or so and i'm just getting my life back
Jan. 11, 2016, 8:15 am
Elizabeth from montreal says:
I tried it before. The meditation is toooo long and very boring. I heard from my classmate that many helpers in Maum Meditation are suffering stress, anxieties and depression. They live in their false picture world with many fantasies about woo myung & his family/cult. Woo myung, the founder of maum meditation, have exploited helpers & members to build his cult. Woo myung can not abandon his greediness to get more members & more money & more centers.
Woo myung is a very selfish person. He had destroyed many helpers’ families and make their kids suffering.
March 23, 2016, 8:51 pm
Li from Suwanee County, Florida says:
Maum meditation cult start building new jonestown (cult center) in my neighborhood. Please stop them to build cult in our peaceful area. I read previous comments about woo myung and his lies to brainwash people and I really afraid.
See the news from suwanee county, florida:
March 24, 2016, 8:29 am
Helper from Europe says:
Hi, I worked as a helper for many years. I see that many helpers in Maum Meditation are suffering stress, anxieties and depression. They live in their false picture world with many fantasies about woo myung & his family/cult. Woo myung, the founder of maum meditation, have exploited helpers & members to build his cult. Woo myung can not abandon his greediness to get more members & more money & more centers.

Woo myung is a very selfish person. He had destroyed many helpers’ families and make their kids suffering. If you are a helper or member, please wake up and discard your fantasies about maum cult and help OTHERS to be free from maum cult.
March 27, 2016, 10:45 am
S. Chase from Brooklyn says:
Helper From Europe: yes. I spent a week and only lost $200. I was feeling powerfully peaceful the one week I did it, willing to ignore small signs from the logical beta part of my brain. I had small questions that felt like childlike curiosities. I didn't delve too deep.

Then out of curiosity for nothing more than a layout of the method and perhaps some additional information about the origin I looked again at the website which is very generic. No real information. Stock photos only and no definition of the type of meditation. I next simply tried "subtraction meditation" in a Google search and saw the comments about it being a cult.
I was already feeling effects of some mild alteration in my brain. I went everyday for a week, 1.5-2.5 hrs a day and walked out feeling insanely wise about myself and my perceptions clouding my experience of life. All of this continued to leave me torn. I wanted to keep going with what I was doing. I had made an appointment for the afternoon the next day which I cancelled as much because I was tired from work as wanting to think about things. I called to cancel and was told by the man answering the phone that he had yet to meet me, but had heard so much about me and was sad Iwasn't coming to the center that day. I said I'd be there the next day. I went back online. I saw more and more evidence of cultish activities. Also of the method being called Maum. I went to my appointment the next day which was as lovely as all the others. At the end I started to feel pushed a little. Pushed to complete my first round of life picture conjuring, pushed to say if I thought I could do this mediation. I kept saying I was willing to try. The Helper kept asking if I could see myself completing the study. I said again I didn't know but wanted to continue coming through the month of paid for.

I started asking more curious questions about them, the Helpers, the center, etc. his description of things matched a little what I'd read in the online warnings. I then asked him sweetly and quietly, being sure not to sound hostile, if the center was Maum. He laughed and said "oh, no! Similar style, and they use subtraction method too," but assured me they are not affiliated. I left quickly and purposely told them I was busy the next few days and would be in touch. I have no intention of returning. I believe everyone who has said this is a cult. It's an extremely powerful mediation, and kn the wrong moment, I feel it could catch anyone off guard. I was even thinking in the middle of the week how much I wanted to try and do another month. I felt committed.

The biggest issue was me asking point blank if it's Maum and them denying it, only to find this article and the woman pictured above was at the center I went to. Why lie, is my point!

Watch out!
April 5, 2016, 3:27 pm
Jack from Chinatown says:
Maum meditation changed its name to subtraction meditation (or many local names) to deceive more people and exploit more members. Its reputation is very bad because its founder woo myung lied and used deceptive marketing. maum meditation has been banned in many areas.

woo myung still can not discard his greediness and suffer mental illness and make members/helpers get stress.

April 8, 2016, 9:12 am
S. Chase from Bk says:
I am determined to run these people out of park slope.
April 12, 2016, 6:24 pm
S Chase says:
I'm going to put this cult out of business.
April 19, 2016, 2:08 pm
Chavez from Colombia says:
This cult is sucking money from members & people. After they exploited members/helpers, then this cult throw them out to the trash.
They pretend and use fake smiles to brainwash members and exploit them. They used many illegal immigrants from Korea. Report them to local authorities if you spot this cult around you.
April 24, 2016, 12:49 pm
DBMS from Manhattan says:
Ok. I feel compelled to write... So I was also a member of a 12 step program and the same negative things about AA and al-anon being a cult can be found online. I was freaked out when I first started and almost didn't continue. I stayed and it changed my life! 12 step programs are not perfect but they change people's lives. Why they have so much negativity about them. No idea. Glad I trusted my gut and didn't listen to online nonsense!!

Same thing with this meditation! I've been doing this meditation method for about 2 years. It is incredible. Most peace I've felt in my life. I am physically healthier. My relationships are better with everyone -at work at home in my family. Everyone I know notices the positive differences. Healthiest community of people I've been around at the center. I studied cults college as a sociology major and this mediation practice is Absolutely NOT a cult. On the outside a little it looks like it but I think that is cultural. The core of the mediation is complete self-autonomy and answers coming from within. So I know that this is Not the dreaded "C" word because my own positive experience and knowledge, also blatently the FBI would have been involved by now!!

If you are reading this and are thinking of meditating and now doubting it because of the garbage online I just want to say to you to trust your own experience, not online paranoia. If you don't want to continue with the meditation then simply don't, but don't not engage in this mediation because of some conspiracy theory wackos online, who have nothing to back up their claims and just create fear. Really look at their claims. I find it sad that someone would write such negative things about something that has brought my own life joy and the life of so many other people I know happiness and peace. And to do so with no substance or claims. Review the negative reviews and tell me if there is substance or substantial claims to them! If there were and there was any harm being done I'd be the first to protest. But simply, there is no harm, only an incredible mediation method that has changed my life and changed so many others I know. I truly feel the real harm is believing this Bologna online and not finding the peace that this mediation has to offer... My best.
June 14, 2016, 8:50 am
lowbh from johor bahru says:
level 1 confirmation
have i died and disappeared?
what sees and know that i have died and disappear?

level 2 confirmation
since mind has been taken out, is there mind?
has my inside and outside become one?

level 3 confirmation
what sees and knowa that myself have died and disappear?
where is the universe
June 30, 2016, 3:15 am
lowbh from johor bahru says:
the cutish element appear after level 4 as you can see from the confirmation
level 4
who is the owner of universe? 2bssn
who is the owner of the body and mind of the universe? body is ansisinim mind is sisinim

level 5?
who is the universe itself? 2bssn
when eyes open whose kingdom is this? 2bssn
where is this place? bonbadak

level 6
have i completely died and Dissapeared? yes
if then only what remains? bonbadak

2bssn means woomyung and his wife
ansisinim means woo myung wife
sisinim means woo myung
bonbadak means original foundation
June 30, 2016, 3:21 am
Corin from Bonbadak says:
This is not a meditation group. From Level 1 to 3, it appears that the method is good and effective. However, cultish element appears in level 4 which you have to acknowledge (2bssn - woo myung and his wife) is the owner of the universe. After that they make you to active flyer distribution and demand more money from you when you finish this study (they called 'Completion'). They always tell you universe mind has true freedom but after completion you will get stuck in this cult group. You will have no personal time as they make you do hong bo (flyer distribution) every week. So my advise is stop at level 3. Level 4 to 7 is just brainwashing session that they want you to accept their culture and everything.
Aug. 7, 2016, 9:51 pm
Xmember from Can says:
Has anybody sued them so far? For psychological abuse??
why are they changing their name time to time?
Maum meditation, then Subtraction med., and now I guess they use their neighbour hood name, i.e. Vancouver meditation...
This is one the signs of a CULT; they change their name so cannot be sued.
Jan. 17, 2017, 4:11 pm
Chase from Brooklyn says:
THIS IS A CULT. This chick CJ who is pictured works at the Brooklyn one.
Jan. 14, 2:46 pm

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